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Hoom Do
Author
Here is a little paragraph I wrote to introduce a character in a work I did for school. Since this work was adressed to people who had not necessarily any clue about fantasy or RPG, but since the work was mainly about those, I was trying to write something that is fantasy, and yet that could be understood by newbies.
Do this paragraph achive this ? How ? What elements do you retain from it ?
(Oh, and this is not really a finished work, it was more of a one time thing I did, but it really is part of a bigger idea I have, although I am not in a creative mood to finish it, those days)
*********************************
Hoom Do
=======
"Master ! Master !! I beg you, you can''t have agreed with that !".
The young Hoon stormed out of the classroom after the elder.
He stopped and turned to her :
"My dear child, I tell you again, it was a good decision, and besides they only asked my opinion for the sake of tradition. If the council decided, I can only agree with them. After all, the are the wisest of us. As a student, you are bound to respect their decision just like me, I thought I had taught you that ages ago."
She nervously scratched her left horn, then her ear :
"But...
-There is no exception, no ''but'', you must obey ! It is for the best anyway.
-But he is a ... Seeker !!!"
The disgust in her voice was almost tangible.
"I can''t possibly travel with a Seeker ! I am scholar, and he is a fighter ! He will take pride in fighting, probably bragging about his deeds all day long, how am I supposed to concentrate on learning anything with a savage like him around me ? I am supposed to give peace to a fallen warrior, not watch over an illiterate barbarian !"
The old Hoon was almost sorry for Hoom Do, but then again, she was the most stubborn student he had ever had. The most brillant as well. He stood up from all his height, his head raised in a dramatic gesture, his horns as dominating as ever. For an old scholar, he was terribly massive, some said he could have been a seeker, if he hadn''t been so good natured. He frowned his face and with all the power of a teacher adressing his student, he said :
-Ho Bo Doumbar is not a savage, as you say, nor is he illiterate. He is a Hoon just like you, he is as Seeker. He chose to follow the Way of the Warrior. You don''t have to judge him on the Way he follows, just like he doesn''t judge you for being a student rather than a worker. His way is a perilous one, and harder than yours in some ways, because he is still looking for himself ! There are numerous things you still have to learn, and probably from sources you don''t expect. One of those is to be more tolerant. Besides, you are a Soulsinger, not a fighter. In the wilderness you wouldn''t last a week ! Most of the other students won''t be finished before another 10 years, but here you are, asking to go on a pilgrimage. If they hadn''t asked for a Soulsinger, they probably would have rejected your offer just like last year... you should be glad they decided to let you go at all. My dear Hoom Do, you are so young...
-I am NOT a child anymore. And I am tired of hearing about my young age, about the fact that most of the other females would wait after they have conceived at least one child, and all this kind of ... of ..."
If her fur could change color, she would probably be have turned red, but it was as brown as ever, her beige muzzle was frowned in anger, and her eyes shining with rage.
"I am NOT going with a Seeker."
She walked down the walkway, and rushed out of the entry.
"Damn it!" she thought, "I can do this alone, why on earth do they have to always take care of me as if I was a new born, I am a Soulsinger ! I a 30, I am the first of my promotion, I can raise the dead, I can comfort lost souls, but no, it''s not enough, they still don''t trust me."
The fresh air calmed her a little bit, the sound of the gravel under her hooves had something hypnotic, as if the stones could sing.
Behind her, master Moo Dah was sitting on the steps of the entrance. He fixed the shape of his student, her black robe floating in the gusts of wind that were crossing the valley at that time of the morning. Ahead of her, the valley was filled with clouds, just like most of the time, the village was not visible from the school of the monastery.
She was not very tall, even for her age, and her horns were not very sharp yet. She could certainly carry her frail body to the end of the world, but what would happen if she had to fight. She had never seen the wilderness, protected as she was, here in the mountains. The monastery was a haven, he thought. He passed his old hand on an equally old scar on his left arm. He had been a pilgrim too.
She had vanished now, but he could still feel the anger in her.
"What did I do in my last life to deserve such a stubborn apprentice ? For sure I must have been a very impatient Hoon to be taught such a lesson about patience..."
He picked a bit of herbs from a pouch under his white robe, and chewing the relaxing plant, grabbed the walking staff that was resting against the stone wall.
"Here you have walls around you to keep you safe, but in the forests of the south, what would keep you protected ? For sure, blessed be the ancients for their insight, Ho Bo Doumbar is the perfect choice for her protection. Besides he is not just a blockhead, and his good humor makes him a perfect companion for travelling. Now I just hope he will be better pleased than her to hear the news."
And with this he raised from the steps and went back inside.
Sancte Isidore ora pro nobis !
I love it ... It''s a pretty basic concept - The kind used in so many fantasy settings, that it is a great way to introduce characters, etc to people that are new to the genre.
What I like about it is it conjrues up wonderful images of what might happen next ... Hopefully you will keep us updated? I would be interested to hear more ...
What I like about it is it conjrues up wonderful images of what might happen next ... Hopefully you will keep us updated? I would be interested to hear more ...
For clarity, I would make hoom and hoon more different words. She wouldn''t scratch her horn, horns have no nerves so they can''t be itchy. You might want to begin with the master refecting about his place in the society and/or his or the student''s physical form and/or describing the mountains they''re in. Other than that, it''s a very good example of conveying exposition without infodumping.
Whos to say horns dont have nerves(!!!). Its your story, you write it how you want. I would like it more if the master ripped the horn out of the girls forehead(lol, I just lie violence). Well that was really good. Good luck!
"I''''ve sparred with creatures from the nine hells themselves... I barely plan on breaking a sweat here, today."~Drizzt Do''''Urden
"I''''ve sparred with creatures from the nine hells themselves... I barely plan on breaking a sweat here, today."~Drizzt Do''''Urden
Author
LOL 
I knew someone would notice the scratching of the horn. That''s the only thing I was gonna change, but didn''t.
You get a pint of Guinness for your attention to detail
And to be exact, horns *do* have nerves and blood vessels, a bit like your teeth... they are just deep inside, and could hardly be sensitive enough to make a horn be itchy. Anyway
BTW, did you get that they are minotaurs ? I was trying to induce it without being too blunt (that is, without using the word "minotaur", or anything like "half cow, half human").
Hoom Do is the name of the heroin, pronounced "Doh", not "Doo".
The similarity is volontary, I wanted to have names that all have the same kind of style (I have designed the region around and a few other things, so it does fit in the context), and be quite different from the names used for the Seyman (the humans), which are more norse/germanic.
The "oo" phonem and othe long vowels are comon to reflect the slowness of the language, and the peacefulness of the race.
Of course I can''t translate all this in just this paragraph, but I try a bit with the references to the respect of elders, the long scholarity, the choosing of a path, etc...
sunandshadow : actually, this paragraph was written in a single shot, in a matter of minutes (I have the background on paper since a long time). But I was then cut in my inspiration and haven''t had the time to rework on it.
My next move was to have the master reflect a bit more and contemplate the landscape around in a transition sequence, up to the point where he is interrupted by the next character ... you get the idea.
Sarazen : my personal goal was to find words and names that can summon up images and questions in your head. for instance, what the heck is a Soul singer, a Seeker, etc... my model is Legend of the 5 Rings. A card game that was so evocative and inspirational that it generated a Roleplaying with more than a dozen background book, and soon a 2nd edition. Not to mention that the card game is still there, with a background story that evolves as the *players* shape it, mostly through tournaments winning. If you already know them, then my Hoons would be very much in the style of the Ise Zumi, the tattooed men of the Dragon Clan.
Drizzt : mmmmh, I don''t think so. I don''t like gratuitous violence (in general), only if it can have a strong emotional effect...
youpla :-P
Sancte Isidore ora pro nobis !
I knew someone would notice the scratching of the horn. That''s the only thing I was gonna change, but didn''t. You get a pint of Guinness for your attention to detail
And to be exact, horns *do* have nerves and blood vessels, a bit like your teeth... they are just deep inside, and could hardly be sensitive enough to make a horn be itchy. Anyway
BTW, did you get that they are minotaurs ? I was trying to induce it without being too blunt (that is, without using the word "minotaur", or anything like "half cow, half human").
Hoom Do is the name of the heroin, pronounced "Doh", not "Doo".
The similarity is volontary, I wanted to have names that all have the same kind of style (I have designed the region around and a few other things, so it does fit in the context), and be quite different from the names used for the Seyman (the humans), which are more norse/germanic.
The "oo" phonem and othe long vowels are comon to reflect the slowness of the language, and the peacefulness of the race.
Of course I can''t translate all this in just this paragraph, but I try a bit with the references to the respect of elders, the long scholarity, the choosing of a path, etc...
sunandshadow : actually, this paragraph was written in a single shot, in a matter of minutes (I have the background on paper since a long time). But I was then cut in my inspiration and haven''t had the time to rework on it.
My next move was to have the master reflect a bit more and contemplate the landscape around in a transition sequence, up to the point where he is interrupted by the next character ... you get the idea.
Sarazen : my personal goal was to find words and names that can summon up images and questions in your head. for instance, what the heck is a Soul singer, a Seeker, etc... my model is Legend of the 5 Rings. A card game that was so evocative and inspirational that it generated a Roleplaying with more than a dozen background book, and soon a 2nd edition. Not to mention that the card game is still there, with a background story that evolves as the *players* shape it, mostly through tournaments winning. If you already know them, then my Hoons would be very much in the style of the Ise Zumi, the tattooed men of the Dragon Clan.
Drizzt : mmmmh, I don''t think so. I don''t like gratuitous violence (in general), only if it can have a strong emotional effect...
youpla :-P
Sancte Isidore ora pro nobis !
Style suggestions
You tend to say everything twice, when once is sufficient. for example, you begin with "Master! Master!.." This is clearly someone calling for the attention of the ''master'', probably from a distance away. You then follow it with ''stormed out of the classroom after the elder'' in a second sentence.
If you then proceeded to talk about the setting, then the second sentence would serve as a transition. But you choose to focus on the master-teacher relation, which is great. But this means the second sentence repeats core of the first few words. I''t redundant. If you removed the second sentence, none of the meaning would be lost.
You do it again a little later with "but he''s a ... seeker" followed by ''the disgust in her voice...'' and then back to her description of the seeker. The sentence describing her disgust adds nothing that the follow-on speech doesn''t illuminate. It''s redundant.
Again with ''he will probably take pride in fighting'' followed immediately by ''braggin about his deeds''. You say the same thing twice.
The only other criticism is the rapid shift from inside the student''s head to the master''s viewpoint. Imagine you had a camera following the story. Imagine that the inside of a character''s head was a separate location for the camera to sit when it watches the character''s thoughts. Generally you only want to move from one location to an adjacent one, and then use a transition, though a breka in teh text (like a new chapter or an extra blank line) is ok.
At first, the camera focuses on the two figures speaking to each other. The locations are connected like:
inside her head - the conversation - inside his head
Then the student leaves the scene. The camera follows the student. we now have four locations:
inside her head - the student - the master - inside his head
And then the camera jumps from inside her head (her thoughts) to inside his head (his visual impressions of her) to outside his head for his actions and speech. So the camera is jerking around a lot. This might be ok if you wanted to further explore the two in parallel so the reader can compare and contrast the characters, but the master''s section appears to be exposition to describe the main character introduce the seeker character.
It''s too much jumping around.
I suggest staying with the master when the student leaves, and letting him speak his piece. Then insert a break and go to the student, where she says her piece and immediately runs into the seeker character. You get to include all the text and the pieces flow together better.
If you feel you need to introduce her powers early on, have the master mention it in his ''you won''t survive for long without a seeker'' bit.
JSwing
You tend to say everything twice, when once is sufficient. for example, you begin with "Master! Master!.." This is clearly someone calling for the attention of the ''master'', probably from a distance away. You then follow it with ''stormed out of the classroom after the elder'' in a second sentence.
If you then proceeded to talk about the setting, then the second sentence would serve as a transition. But you choose to focus on the master-teacher relation, which is great. But this means the second sentence repeats core of the first few words. I''t redundant. If you removed the second sentence, none of the meaning would be lost.
You do it again a little later with "but he''s a ... seeker" followed by ''the disgust in her voice...'' and then back to her description of the seeker. The sentence describing her disgust adds nothing that the follow-on speech doesn''t illuminate. It''s redundant.
Again with ''he will probably take pride in fighting'' followed immediately by ''braggin about his deeds''. You say the same thing twice.
The only other criticism is the rapid shift from inside the student''s head to the master''s viewpoint. Imagine you had a camera following the story. Imagine that the inside of a character''s head was a separate location for the camera to sit when it watches the character''s thoughts. Generally you only want to move from one location to an adjacent one, and then use a transition, though a breka in teh text (like a new chapter or an extra blank line) is ok.
At first, the camera focuses on the two figures speaking to each other. The locations are connected like:
inside her head - the conversation - inside his head
Then the student leaves the scene. The camera follows the student. we now have four locations:
inside her head - the student - the master - inside his head
And then the camera jumps from inside her head (her thoughts) to inside his head (his visual impressions of her) to outside his head for his actions and speech. So the camera is jerking around a lot. This might be ok if you wanted to further explore the two in parallel so the reader can compare and contrast the characters, but the master''s section appears to be exposition to describe the main character introduce the seeker character.
It''s too much jumping around.
I suggest staying with the master when the student leaves, and letting him speak his piece. Then insert a break and go to the student, where she says her piece and immediately runs into the seeker character. You get to include all the text and the pieces flow together better.
If you feel you need to introduce her powers early on, have the master mention it in his ''you won''t survive for long without a seeker'' bit.
JSwing
That depends on if you want to get technical. Personally, I think the best writing comes from the inspiration to the page. I rarely edit my writings afterwards ...
It may not be the most TECHNICAL piece of writing, but I know that it''s pure emotion. Where does technicallity have a place in the arts? (Anyone that considers programming, etc an art, please don''t take offence. I mean art as in the general sense that most people see it in...)
I liked it because it was a good, natural read.
It may not be the most TECHNICAL piece of writing, but I know that it''s pure emotion. Where does technicallity have a place in the arts? (Anyone that considers programming, etc an art, please don''t take offence. I mean art as in the general sense that most people see it in...)
I liked it because it was a good, natural read.
quote: Original post by Sarazen
That depends on if you want to get technical. Personally, I think the best writing comes from the inspiration to the page. I rarely edit my writings afterwards ...
It may not be the most TECHNICAL piece of writing, but I know that it''s pure emotion. Where does technicallity have a place in the arts? (Anyone that considers programming, etc an art, please don''t take offence. I mean art as in the general sense that most people see it in...)
I liked it because it was a good, natural read.
You''d be surprised at how most professional writers (and artists in general) work
Author
Jswing, thanks for your critics, at least you make constructive ones
But I must say you comment more like a technician than a creative (I won''t use the word artist, just to spare us a flamewar, please read the Game Design thread for my verbose argument about all this ... )
Saying things once is sufficient, but saying it twice is not a waste of memory, you know
I must say I understand what you are saying, but I don''t understand what would be gained in terms of style by cutting text.
Then again, if you have ever seen me post on Gamedev, you might have noticed I am a bit on the verbose side ...
One of the reason I repeat things is to be able to put more information eveytime I do so.
"Master ! Master! I beg you" she is really worried about , something. The second sentence introduce the word Hoon, the fact that she''s storming out (again, she''s running after someone), out of a classroom (so she''s a sort of student).
"He will take pride in figthing ..." Ah, yes, on that one I agree I had a feeling of something sligthly wrong here, you confirm my doubts. I''ll rephrase that.
Camera movements ...
what can I say ? It''s really a question of personal preference. Although I agree that I have a lot of different POV in a short time, I didn''t think they were a nuisance, as thy convey a sense of movement to the discussion and a rythm that I personally felt where quite adapted to the situation.
But I was looking for a way to show that there were those camera movements... I guess separating my text a bit more clearly, by adding a blank line should be better
If I used the order you suggest, I''d feel in a german expressionist movie, or maybe a Chinese art movie; think Nosferatu, or the Scent of the Green Papaya, excellent movies, yes, but VERY slow. Not adapted to what I want here. I would use slow camera movements to convey the sense of peacefulness of the Hoons when they are meditating. Not when there is a fight or an argument like here !
In camera terms, here is what I see in my head :
camera follows Hoom Do as she storms out of the classroom.
Pan to Moo Bah as he is going towards the exit of the building.
Camera stops the panning on him as he start speaking.
Close up shot of Hoom Do "But ..."
Close up of Mood Dah.
American shot (waist level) of Hoom Do.
Then Standing shot of Hoom Do as she speaks here first long reply.
Same for Moo Dah as he answers.
(By viewing the whole bodies, you can show the difference in stances, and body gestures, Hoom Do is nervous and angry, Moo Dah is calm and full of dignity).
Close up shot again as Hoom Do speaks her final words.
Close up on the eyes as she says "I am NOT going with a seeker"
Standing shot behind Moo Dah''s shoulder, looking at Hoom Do leaving.
The camera follows her, looking at the path going down the slope, towards the valley (she''s seen from the back, from Moo Dah''s POV, high angle shot). Moo Dah sits when she dissapears in the slope.
Then standing (well, sitting) shot at a low angle of Moo Dah, seen sitting and thoughtful. (the low angle and high angle shots are used to show the background better...)
Camera stays there until he goes back inside.
Fade to black
See ?
Sarazen : though I appreciate your comment, you must know one thing. Inspiration and working on emotions is good and necessary for the artist. But the lack of technicity will doom him/her to failure in the end.
Without technical skills you can''t sustain the effort in the long term, and you lack solid foundations on which to build your own house (to use the parabol).
I love working on inspiration alone because that''s the way I am, and because I am good at it. But as I mentioned on the first post. This is an unfinished work.
Because past the first burst of inspiration, I was exhausted (metaphorically speaking) and could not go on.
And once the inspiration is gone ...
I wish you never have to know what it is to stay there without inspiration for weeks and weeks ... I feel empty and depressed when it happens... hopefully I''ll find a muse again
Dactylos : you are totally right (cf above).
Sancte Isidore ora pro nobis !
But I must say you comment more like a technician than a creative (I won''t use the word artist, just to spare us a flamewar, please read the Game Design thread for my verbose argument about all this ... )
Saying things once is sufficient, but saying it twice is not a waste of memory, you know
I must say I understand what you are saying, but I don''t understand what would be gained in terms of style by cutting text.
Then again, if you have ever seen me post on Gamedev, you might have noticed I am a bit on the verbose side ...
One of the reason I repeat things is to be able to put more information eveytime I do so.
"Master ! Master! I beg you" she is really worried about , something. The second sentence introduce the word Hoon, the fact that she''s storming out (again, she''s running after someone), out of a classroom (so she''s a sort of student).
"He will take pride in figthing ..." Ah, yes, on that one I agree
I had a feeling of something sligthly wrong here, you confirm my doubts. I''ll rephrase that.Camera movements ...
what can I say ? It''s really a question of personal preference. Although I agree that I have a lot of different POV in a short time, I didn''t think they were a nuisance, as thy convey a sense of movement to the discussion and a rythm that I personally felt where quite adapted to the situation.
But I was looking for a way to show that there were those camera movements... I guess separating my text a bit more clearly, by adding a blank line should be better
If I used the order you suggest, I''d feel in a german expressionist movie, or maybe a Chinese art movie; think Nosferatu, or the Scent of the Green Papaya, excellent movies, yes, but VERY slow. Not adapted to what I want here. I would use slow camera movements to convey the sense of peacefulness of the Hoons when they are meditating. Not when there is a fight or an argument like here !
In camera terms, here is what I see in my head :
camera follows Hoom Do as she storms out of the classroom.
Pan to Moo Bah as he is going towards the exit of the building.
Camera stops the panning on him as he start speaking.
Close up shot of Hoom Do "But ..."
Close up of Mood Dah.
American shot (waist level) of Hoom Do.
Then Standing shot of Hoom Do as she speaks here first long reply.
Same for Moo Dah as he answers.
(By viewing the whole bodies, you can show the difference in stances, and body gestures, Hoom Do is nervous and angry, Moo Dah is calm and full of dignity).
Close up shot again as Hoom Do speaks her final words.
Close up on the eyes as she says "I am NOT going with a seeker"
Standing shot behind Moo Dah''s shoulder, looking at Hoom Do leaving.
The camera follows her, looking at the path going down the slope, towards the valley (she''s seen from the back, from Moo Dah''s POV, high angle shot). Moo Dah sits when she dissapears in the slope.
Then standing (well, sitting) shot at a low angle of Moo Dah, seen sitting and thoughtful. (the low angle and high angle shots are used to show the background better...)
Camera stays there until he goes back inside.
Fade to black
See ?
Sarazen : though I appreciate your comment, you must know one thing. Inspiration and working on emotions is good and necessary for the artist. But the lack of technicity will doom him/her to failure in the end.
Without technical skills you can''t sustain the effort in the long term, and you lack solid foundations on which to build your own house (to use the parabol).
I love working on inspiration alone because that''s the way I am, and because I am good at it. But as I mentioned on the first post. This is an unfinished work.
Because past the first burst of inspiration, I was exhausted (metaphorically speaking) and could not go on.
And once the inspiration is gone ...
I wish you never have to know what it is to stay there without inspiration for weeks and weeks ... I feel empty and depressed when it happens... hopefully I''ll find a muse again
Dactylos : you are totally right (cf above).
Sancte Isidore ora pro nobis !
quote: Original post by ahw
Jswing, thanks for your critics, at least you make constructive ones
But I must say you comment more like a technician than a creative
Sure. I only had technical suggestions because I think the content is pretty good.
quote:
Saying things once is sufficient, but saying it twice is not a waste of memory, you know
I must say I understand what you are saying, but I don''t understand what would be gained in terms of style by cutting text.
Repeating a sentence (or phrase) tends to weaken it. It makes it sounds as if the sentence doesn''t quite do what it should, so you wrote it again.
quote:
One of the reason I repeat things is to be able to put more information eveytime I do so.
"Master ! Master! I beg you" she is really worried about , something. The second sentence introduce the word Hoon, the fact that she''s storming out (again, she''s running after someone), out of a classroom (so she''s a sort of student).
This is great as long as you''re adding information. The second sentence lets us know the protagonist a Hoon. The rest repeats what we already know (she''s a servant or student, she is agitated, she demands the attention of someone not immediately near her - we can get all of that from the first sentence).
Re:Camera movements ...
I think my camera analogy was a bad one. I thought about this some more, so let me try a different description.
I see a pattern where you start talking about A, then start to transition to B (good so far). But then you jump over to C, as if C followed from A. B is left dangling.
Example1: first 3 sentences
"Master! Master! ..." - this is A. A person is crying out to someone else about a particular thing (decision)
The young Hoon ... - this is B. We describe the speaker, and the speaker''s motion. Physical descriptions, a mention of a classroom setting.
He stopped ... followed by his words - this is C. His response to her cries follows directly from A (her cries). B is left dangling.
Example2:the beginning of the conversation
"But ... he is a Seeker!" - this is A. She is expressing her feelings. The subject is the student (via an invisible ''she said'') We are hearing from the student directly.
Her disgust was ... - this is B. This transitions to describing her tone. The subject is her disgust, and we are hearing about it indirectly, as described by the author.
"I can''t ..." - her speech continues. We''re back to her direct speech again. This follows from A, and completely skips over B.
There is a difference between:
"But ... he is a Seeker," she said with disgust. "I can''t ...."
and
"But ... he is a Seeker!" Her disgust was almost tangible. "I can''t..."
Example3: After she exits
Her long quote - this is A. We have just moved from her leaving to her feelings. Here she expresses her frustration.
The fresh air ... [singing stones] - this is B. We transition successfully from her feelings to her new surroundings. Now the text is a description of the outdoors, or her interaction with it.
Behind her, master... - this is C. This follows from A (her) rather than B (the surroundings).
This one could be handled with a break in the text (blank line), which is what I think you intended.
It happens again when you go from her boiling anger "I''m tired of .." to a brief description of coat color "...her normal brown..." then kind of settles on the physical expression of her fury "...her muzzle frowned...''
And you do the repetition here "frowned in anger" "shone with rage". Describing her physical reaction is fine, but I don''t think there''s a need to repeat that she''s mad.
quote:
If I used the order you suggest, I''d feel in a german expressionist movie, or maybe a Chinese art movie;
Not adapted to what I want here. I would use slow camera movements to convey the sense of peacefulness of the Hoons when they are meditating. Not when there is a fight or an argument like here !
Fair enough. It is a style choice. I''m less concerned by the speed than by abrupt jumps and reversals. Smooth doesn''t necessarily mean slow.
JSwing
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